BUGA Community
General Category => CF Bedford Chat => Topic started by: SkippyThBushKangeroo on October 22, 2014, 08:09:48 AM
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mornin all.. a while back i got a set of front springs out of a lwb beddie an put them in "ol futile" lifted the front end a beaut.. but have now noticed both outer front tyre treads are worn on the side :'( so assume i have changed the camber of the front wheels ??? ??? ( i believe there is no adjustment on front end for it ). i know my old springs were 11 inches high, but are down south so cant slip em back in... anyone know what the camber should be (if any).. at a look it appears the wheels are not square ( top to bottom ) but tilted slightly outwards at the top of the wheels can i cut these springs down to reatain the camber if they are higher than 11 inches... or am i stuffed ..thanks for any input in advance groovers ;)
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You can redrill your bottom arm mounts (4 bolts each side) or get the springs reset
Another thing you can do is add bump stops to cut down your turning circle, at full lock the cf will push one wheel instead of turn, this is fine on skinny tyres but bigger ones it can cause a lot of wear. Or even just get in the habit of when you turn hard lock, turn the wheel back half a turn so it is more turning than pushing the wheel
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Hi Skippy, yep there is no camber adjustment on the standard front suspension. The factory setting is positive 1 degree on the front wheels the theory being that with a bit of weight in the van you would get spring sag and you would typically run at zero degrees camber. Your taller springs have caused the opposite effect and you are now running too positive in the camber department which is borne out by your comment that the tyres are angling out towards the top of the wheels.
The issue with heating and resetting your front coils is that it is a bit of a bugger trying to get them even and every time you heat the spring you run the possibility of reducing the carbon content in the spring itself. I've never been able to get a company that would guarantee a perfect result. My suggestion would be to cut a bit out of the bottom of each spring as it should then just re-seat in the lower arm spring seat. The trick is working out how much to cut out of the bottom coil. If you have the time and are prepared to go through the process of installing and removing a few times, I would suggest cutting bits out in increments and refitting until you get what you are looking for.
The other option is to go with Busy's suggestion, but that could lead to greater issues if you don't get the new holes spot on, bump steer being an example.
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Hey Skip, not fun...
There are new springs on evilbay at not ridiculous prices..... may be the best option and cost less than a pair of new tyres, but would need to confirm they are the right ones!
Unless you can get your old springs up north.
I wouldn't heat treat what you have and only cut if desperate.
evilbay link is http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/King-Springs-Coil-Spring-KBFS-01-/151414028214?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&fits=Make%3ABedford&hash=item2340fab7b6 (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/King-Springs-Coil-Spring-KBFS-01-/151414028214?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&fits=Make%3ABedford&hash=item2340fab7b6)
Russell
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To adjust the camber adding negative (to make it neutral) you need to put shims under the 'dog bones' that hold the lower control arm to the cross member. There will be 4 bolts per side, requiring 4 shims per side
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also if you have done any changes to ride height or camber adjustments , even if you just replace ball joints or rack ends etc, I'd highly recommend getting a wheel alignment!
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thanks for input guys was thinkin of gordons remedy till your input matte.... is it really that easy ??? ??? if so ;D ;D do i justt keep shimmin till the angle is zero matte?
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Yeah basically, tho I'd limit the amount of shims going in to a reasonable amount, any more than 10mm would have me a little concerned. Try a couple of shims and see where it's at, hopefully you don't need to go too far anyway
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i agree with busy 100 percent i know blokes that never go full lock because it rips out your tyres. changing the camber like you did wiuth the higher springs would have enhanced the problem. the bedfords steering geomtry is not quite right (to do with the steering arms) and the consequence is the tyres curling under on full lock.
cornering sharply would attribute to most of the your wear i would think.
id reccommend to do your shimming as matte suggested and dont do u turns:)
ben
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hi groovers thanks for input.... was going to go the shim way till i got under there an remembered that one side of the pass lower control arm in already shimmed with a 10m flat steel .. ( curtesy of the concrete block that stopped me suddenly,an bent crossmember, but did save me from plunging into pt adelaide river. ) .. so seems the "slicing of the springs" seems the only real option.. sigh.. i asked a friend to measure old springs they got back to me sayin they were 275mm or 11 inches high ?? measured these LWB ones an they are only 262mm high so no able to cut these to the original ones height.. double sigh.. is this `right LWB are shorter coils than SWB?, or could my friend have possibly mis informed me the height? my quandery on this is because the bottom of the coil, straightens slighty ( in spring pic the spring is sitting on its top so is upside down in pic) am very wary an unsure on lengths of the increments to be cut, using a set square on level concrete .butted top of square against top of tyre an let bottom of square rest on cement,..showing a 8mm gap between set square at bottom an bottom side of tyre on drivers side n 10mm gap on pass side.. any thoughts on this dillema folks .. cheers skippy :-)
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I have a set of each and should hopefully be able to get up and measure them later on this week if all goes well.
From memory there isn't much height difference, just thickness of the springs
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cheers busy ;) .... ah!!the thickness??? triganometry n physics was never my finer points at school ::) ::) .. am scared to start with even 5 mm increments ... but dont want to like.."cut em" 9 times?? pretty sure am venturing into the unresearched n unknown.. :P still pluckin up courage to start" cutting" lol :-\ :-\
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AHHHH ! another trait you just gotta rise up to the challenge when owning a bedford. ;D ;D
we just keep an eye on the tyres and get them turned on the rim to even out the wear...doesnt cost to much at your local tyre bloke...
great turning ability comes at a cost i guess :-\
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The things with springs is heat, cutting the springs can soften them, drop saw would be the coolest (less heat) method, angle grinder and oxy/acl use to much heat.
You could use spacers to find out how much you need (even if it's 20mm), just think triangles, pack it out until you have it as you want it then make a triangle to see where the bolts would be.
Have just had my first coffee of the day so am a bit blah still, but that triangle should relate to the height, transfer rather. Only downside to packing it, or even cutting the springs is the suspension needs to settle when back under it's own weight. Sorry brain not working. Try a wheel alignment place for a formula for height/camber
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cheers busy.. went to have a chat wiv guy at pedders .. when i said a bedford he did not want a bar of it.. :o "to hard" :o he said i said >:( "your sign behind you says the proffesionals"??? "at what"? i said" pulling yourself n stickin your head in a bucket of sand"?? .. and then he wouldnt talk to me anymore ! ::) ::) .. i have access to a drop saw but cant really see a way to hold it securly , so was thinking of submerging spring in water an just using a cutting wheel on a grinder?? still very apprehensive of startin the cut though. :-\ all a part of my libran indecisivness lol .. ;D
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I cut mine with one of those real fine cut off discs Took one full turn off which lowered it 1 inch
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what happened re the camber reid??.... sigh "bedfordus" the god of "all things trying" is not smiling upon me :-[ things were actually popping off nicely till this ... only a year old .. noticed both boots were split too ... wish i had these old springs up here with me.. :'( :'( :'(
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Never had it checked Looks ok steers ok When I start using it more I will get it checked
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I renewed everything when I done the disc break conversion As far as the rear I took 2 leaves out & renewed everything It came down 40mm & softened up the ride I think you said that you hit something with the front sub frame which required shims Do you think it may be bent Maybe you should try & find another complete front end Some won should have one laying around
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had that checked an only bit bent was where was shimmed ,.. all else checked out ok i was led to believe.. ::) . scored the lwb front end ,
in adelaide but on closer inspection realised it also had copped :o a belt :o somewhere down the track, so just used springs out of it ,.. had a wheel align done in adelaide before left for north , asian guy muttered something about "camber".. but i didnt understand him, guess i do now lol ... see if i can get old ones sent from sa if chop isnt " to my advantage" , just a thought, if they did go over a tad ,i summise i could space them in the wishbone to regain the camber?? ??